Sunday, December 09, 2007

Confidence and results

I've been thinking a bit about confidence, both in terms of how it affects my game, as well as relating it to other things. My poker game is just not strong enough yet to have unwavering confidence in it, even though I believe that I usually have an advantage at the tables. I am OK at sizing up other players, and I'm improving there. I usually feel like I'm one of the two best players at the table, since I tend to leave unless I've got great position on someone...and then I usually feel like I can stay out of trouble from the guys behind me, if they are strong. I feel like I can recognize mistakes in my game and do a pretty good job analyzing others' hands...certainly I don't feel too lost in any poker conversation.

So, bottom line, in my head, I'm confident enough to succeed. But I think if I'm honest with myself that I don't believe it in my gut. I find myself questioning myself at game time too often for me to have confidence in my confidence, if that makes any sense. I cannot yet get past the hands I lose big, if it wasn't a clear cooler or clear bad beat (those bug me less and less).

I made a forum post the other day discussing what I think is a crucial step up in development, which is not worrying too much about getting outplayed. I cited Taylor's videos as an example...over and over (but not too often), he will make a play and say he's not sure it's correct. For example, someone will raise him, and he'll say something like, "I think I could have the best hand, but I'm going to give him credit this time," as he folds. To him, there's a distinct possibility that his opponent just outplayed him, but he makes the fold and goes on to the next hand. Now, I imagine Taylor is pretty secure in the knowledge that on the whole he is getting far the best of the outplaying battle, but that doesn't mean he won't get outplayed on an individual hand. That's the crucial step I was thinking about....not worrying about any particular hand someone outplays you. As long as you are realistically outplaying everyone else -- whether it be from well-timed bluffs, folds where other people call down second best, making thin value bets, or any other number of things -- who cares if they get the best of you on a single hand?

Well, if you have confidence in your game...feeling it in your gut...I don't think you do care too much. You let them have this hand, and just get on with business. I still have a hard time accepting getting outplayed, and I think it's mostly to do with the fact that I don't feel in my gut that I'm outplaying people on a regular basis. I probably am, but I'm not 100% behind that thought.

My NL career is still under 100k hands, and my win rate over that time is pretty anemic. The issue with poker is that even over 100k hands, you don't know exactly how good you are, and especially over the first huge chunk of hands, your game (and most everyone else's you play against at the micros) are changing anyway. But what sorts of objective measures do you have of how well you're doing? Even someone watching you and providing good feedback isn't objective for true confidence (although it helps) because they can only see you for such a small sample.

There are a lot of subjective measures, including the feedback you get, which are all extremely helpful, but the bottom line is that there is only one bottom line, and that is money won/lost. And that's a crappy measurement as far as feedback goes because it takes so long for win rates to normalize. By many subjective measures, my game is solid, but the two kind of objective measurements...experience and win rate are undecided.

So, when I have a week like this, where the last 5 sessions all resulted in small or moderate losses -- even though I can point to the reasons why some of it would have occurred, where I actually made good decisions, and where I successfully identified my mistakes, I still look to the small losing streak (and we're only talking about 6 BI over ~3k hands), and a part of me wonders. It wonders whether I'm looking at things as realistically as I think I am...not that I'm deceiving myself, but maybe I really don't know as much as I think...well that my gap is more than the normal gap between how much people think they know, and what they actually know.

Thinking about the tone of this post, it may seem negative, but it's really not...I'm comfortable with the belief that I basically know what I'm doing, and I know enough to know that there's a lot I don't know. I'm just dwelling on this post on the little nagging doubt that still exists, that keeps me from being 100% sure of myself -- and therefore uncaring of any negative results -- when I hit the inevitable bumps in the road.

It sucks for me because I am so results oriented in the sense that I want to win whatever I'm doing, and losing takes away from the enjoyment of the activity...and this is the same in poker as it is in other sports as it is at work as it is doing a crossword puzzle. My happiness depends on too large a part in whether I'm succeeding at all these things, and not as much on the activity itself, on the pursuit of learning, improvement, and just having fun.

There's a saying (I saw it on a bumper sticker first) that the worst day of golf -- or fishing, skiing, etc. -- is better than the best day at the office. But that's not really true for me. My favorite sport is now golf, but when I'm not playing well, I really can't wait for the round to be over...and this is after waking up at the crack of dawn to get there. Same thing was true when I played tennis a lot....even in a social match if I were not playing up to my standards, I couldn't wait for it to be over. Forget the exercise, the outdoors, the camaraderie, the chance to practice something that wasn't working, the fact that you are not at the office. Results matter.

At least in those other areas, you are much more responsible for your results, or at least luck does not enter much into it at all. In poker, you don't even get that luxury (and that's why I've never been a fan of BB/100 related goals). When the chips don't slide my way, I get too easily disgusted. When I'm not on my A game, that disgust snowballs into worse play and more bad results. When I am on my A game, I still don't enjoy it, and that's nuts...not to the point I should just find something else to do, but the true measure of enjoyment at the low stakes should be about how well I play, and that's about it. Of course the profits are nice, but they are not going to be life changing, nor will the losses. That may come one day, but it's not there yet. I understand it's different for pros who rely on that income...one of the many reasons it must be much harder to be a pro. But I'm not in that situation.

Actually, the situation that I'm in right now is that I need to go help the kids with something, so I'm going to finally wrap this up. To reiterate, my state of mind remains positive overall. I'll try to make the next post a little lighter, in length and in attitude.

3 comments:

Bazclef said...

Nice post. You’re definitely right, you don’t need to be better than everyone in the game to beat the game… and it’s difficult but it’d definitely be an edge to be ego-less and not have your confidence knocks when someone outplays you.

I might be swinging off on a tangent a little here… but it’s an interesting topic…

I understand how your current 3k run makes you feel, I’m sure anyone that’s played a lot of cash does. After reading Verneer’s post quoting that CTS was a small loser over 100k hands it really makes you wonder how it’d be possible to take that sort of incredible pressure under constant negative feedback from your results.

Ed Miller recently linked to a great article (http://www.thepokerchronicles.com/archives/000947.html) written by one of his friends, a professional player, which describes incredibly well how psychologically difficult it is to believe in yourself when 90% of the tools you have to measure your success are telling you that you’re failing. I’ve got a huge amount of respect for the professional players that have been able to ride through that.

Verneer wrote something in his latest post which gave me a lot of reassurance that if I ever go on a bad run I’d be able to get correct feedback on whether I am actually playing profitably or not…

“An experienced player can watch you play for a couple hundred hands and tell if you are going to be a winner or loser at a level (which once again shows the importance of a good coach or quality player sweating you here and there). When I watch some players I can tell they will be winners at 100NL and 200NL - regardless of their results. They are making correct plays and don't have glaring leaks.”

It’s definitely reassuring to know that if a downswing extended for a long period of time and it became impossible to hold a decent level of confidence that there would be a way to get (hopefully) positive feedback on your play… and reassurance that you are doing things right.

Anyways, I definitely flew off on a tangent there, just some things I’ve been thinking about too though. ;)

RakebackFAQ said...

Long post and good one too. Baz's answer is pretty good to. Just by reading this it seems that your very competitive and thats not a bad thing at all if its used correctly. I myself have a problem kind of like that, if things arent going my way ill mostlikely quit and browse forums etc. This really hurts the number of hands i get in and if i ever want to make serious money its something ill have to get over.

Kind of like you getting over losing pots. The hard part is how to do that. I remember doing a coaching session one time with a guy called Nolan1 on cr and we were just chatting talking about favorite hands and stuff and he got 10Js utg i said thats my favorite hands and he said he liked it too but sighed and folded. I thought wow why did you do that and he simply answerd iam OOP and it dosent play well from there ( this was full ring)just a little eg of dicipline that you need to win at this game, I think once you get that in your game everything else will follow.

One thing i believe would work in your case is playing more tables, by doing this it would give you less time to dwell on these issues that annoy you. Also you could do a pt review to have a look at your progress. Do one for your 1st 20k hands , then the next 20k and so on, I think you have got to see some progress in areas like aggrasion, Hand selection i imagine your 1st lot would have lots of 56 type hands 89s and alot of them limped. But as you get up in numbers you would see less of these and a large % of them raised. Ok its not BB/100 or $ but its one area of progress in your game right?. Another would be position, Pairs etc. Its a great way to see if you are going in the right direction and if the 1st 20k is the same as the last 20k you played its there infront of you that you havent learned but IMO i think you will see a big change as you get up in the numbers.

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=4946669&page=0&fpart=all&vc=1

All the best
Willie

Marc said...

Thanks for the replies, guys...long posts invite long replies :). You guys are right on...I read that article Ed Miller linked, it is really good (I used to read that guy's blog...should start again). I go through the PT review exercise Willie linked....monthly, so like 10-12k chunks. It's a great way to review, although I haven't noticed all that much improvement over the months, as far as the stats go...but they were pretty good to start with. And that is another good way to get some "objective" self feedback on your play...reviewing stats. For instance, if you see that your button VPIP is like 2.5x your UTG VPIP and the preflop raise is pretty close to the VPIP, etc., you can feel pretty confident that you have the basics of a foundation in place. Good idea, there.